[Jennie Rothenberg Gritz wrote:]
We filmed our first installment of The Table at Aspen yesterday. As you might have noticed, if you've been following the evolution of our Atlantic videos, we generally shoot in a fairly controlled indoor environment. We've been wanting to expand our horizons, though, and yesterday's session gave us a crash course in on-location flexibility. Somehow, when we set up our Table sessions for 4 p.m., nobody bothered to tell us that thunderstorms roll through Aspen at exactly that time each day.
Everything ended up all right, but we had to lug all our gear back and forth a few times from tent to lecture hall and then back outside again. At one point, Matt Yglesias, observing our tangle of wires plugged into the wet tent poles, remarked, "Ah, electricity and water. Together at last."
In any case, the discussion itself went very well. Ross moderated beautifully and smoothed over our brief weather delay. In this first installment, Ross introduces the speakers and launches into the first question: is higher education for everyone really a plausible goal? More from this session to come.
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Is Higher Education For Everyone?
02 Jul 2008 09:11 am
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Comments (12)
It would be interesting to know if you track the number of people who attend and complete college after they officially join the workforce? I attended school at night and on weekends for 13 years to obtain an undergraduate and a graduate degree, all while working full time. Where would someone like me fall in your analysis?
I also think that people who receive certifications or journeyman cards should be considered when evaluating the number of people who attend higher education. Many of these people attend community college classes in order to become certified in things like plumbing or perhaps or as a firefighter. Would you consider these a form of higher education?
In my mind, everyone needs some type of education beyond high school. We need to stop treating high school as the end of some road.
Whether it's the usual path toward an undergraduate degree or a path toward a vocational degree, it's all higher education. We need to remove the stigma from the vocational track and treat all of it as higher education.
At some point, that person who became an electrician may decide that more education is necessary so that they can study electrical engineering. If not, there will always be a need for electricians, plumbers, medical transcriptionists, barbers, etc. These jobs require skills and that's the point - acquiring skills and knowledge beyond high school is crucial. People cannot rely only on a high school diploma for anything more than it's an indication of moving on to the next step.
What a provacative (if not misleading) title for this enstallment of The Table - "is higher education really for everyone?".
Really, Ross, is that the question you should be asking?
What I want to know is why there is not more political will to keep those foreign born recipients of higher education degrees from US
My posting got cut off...
What I want to know is why there is not more political will to keep those foreign born recipients of higher education degrees from US universities here in the US after they graduate?
I think it's the optimism of the US that makes people feel like everyone should get a "higher education." In other countries, those that are going to go into trade industries openly know that they will not be going into higher education and it's understood that that is your role.
Let us not underestimate the power of private universities in the overall landscape of higher education. While there are plenty of wonderful public universities throughout the country, there remains a prevalent notion that a degree from a private school is worth more. If we can convince students that an education at a public or community college is well worth their time, while increasing funding for hiring and outreach, many students may realize their potential for success in post-high school academia.
Agreeing with Steadman.. one of the most ironic issues about higher education in the US is the phenomenon that we deport so many foreign students after they obtain their undergraduate and post-graduate degrees at US universities. What effect will that have on jobs in the US over the next decades?
With all of the public and private resources for financial help out there for students from underpriveleged households, the $40,000 a year pricetag for private colleges is such a deterrent that many don't even apply, not realizing that financial help will most likely come after being accepted.
i don't think colleges and universities are for everyone. but, try telling that to a division I basketball or football coach. a student who wants to make the NFL or NBA realistically has one path and that's through college whether they want to go to college or not. college athletes run the gamut from very bright to very stupid, yet college is their path. why? it's a very poor model.
sean lancaster is missing the point. The chances of anyone becoming a professional athlete are less than those of winning a state big ball lottery, yet how many kids still think that's their ticket to financial success...
What the US needs - and India and China both have - is a new culture that emphasizes scientists and engineers as role models if the US is going to be able to compete in a global economy.
my point has nothing to do with whether a student-athlete (or should i say, "athelete-student") has any chance; rather, my point is that colleges and universities will bend over backwards to get elite athletes to attend their schools. if you watched the video, the final speaker notes that many universities build their reputations on how many students they can deny acceptance to (e.g., Univ. of Michigan, Stanford), yet they wouldn't think twice about taking a basketball star who earned the minimum NCAA acceptance scores on various tests. there's something very wrong with that model. i think higher education is watered down when we make exception after exception for students who are intellectually far behind other students. and, if we're going to do it for some then we might as well open the floodgates up and just realize that higher education is for everywhere. a master's degree can become the new higher ed. but if i had my way, i would tell the NFL and NBA to build their own minor league systems and let higher education institutions focus more on academics with intramural sports taking a backseat. ha! the bowl football games and the NCAA final four are way to big to take a backseat to academics. that's sad commentary on our higher education system and that sort of gets are your point about China and India.
While the discussion touched on it, the fact is, I think, that our country needs students to believe and hold a vision that their education is important and that it is the future for them. They need to believe in getting a good high school education followed by appropriate education and training beyond high school (appropriate to their interests, aptitudes, and goals) and then continuing education in maintenance and enhancement of their competencies throughout life. I think that is a broader problem and broader question. Many youth burn with goals and desire and will make it. Too many never have a goal and languish from as early as 4th or 5th grade (or before) and just never get a chance to make it. All the kids need to be reached appropriately.
It's great to see the Table in such exotic locales!
I think availability is certainly an important issue, but I think Mr. Verkuil hit on exactly the correct point: the need to define higher education more broadly. If all American citizens have access to the technical, skills-based, and non-traditional educational paths (i.e. not four year universities) society would be much better served.
Though the counterpoint would be the recent Atlantic article on the cruelty of shunting people into any higher educational system. It would be great to hear them address that point.
Posted by Mark | July 2, 2008 8:50 PM